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Thread: Looking for tires

  1. #1
    MoJo Bishop Smitty's Avatar
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    Question Looking for tires

    Since I know the people on this board ride a hell of a lot more than I do (unfortunately), I felt I would ask the local "experts" for some advice. I am in the market for some new tires for my GF Sugar. Since I can't afford to own a tire for every condition, I need a good all around tire in the under 2" range. The reason for this is that little arch across the rear tire that makes for zero clearance on a bigger tire. How do I know this you may ask? Well, my current tire (Specialized Cactus Master) has about enough clearance to slip a piece of paper through. Anyway, Bike Magazine did a review on a tire by IRC (don't remember the model) and their opinion was you just about couldn't go wrong. I want to know what you guys think since you are riding the same places I am. Thanks.
    Last edited by Smitty; 07-11-2001 at 01:18 PM.
    Some are wise. Some are otherwise.

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    Avatar Farmer Big T's Avatar
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    Hehehe. Ahem. Carlos you're up...
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  3. #3
    MoJo Mother Superior Chris aka Killer's Avatar
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    If the clearance was not an issue I would recommend the Panaracer fire xc pros, you may be able to get away with the 1.8 xc pros. Dr Marque rides these.

    I have recently aquired some Hutchinson pythons. They have a low profile and should work well on the fisher. If you want to try them on your bike, I'll be at Mcallister tonight and tommorow.

    They are excellent for dusty, tight singletrack like McAllister. They also served me quite well for 81 miles at Comfort.

    I ran them at City Park and austin this last weekend. i was somewhat disappointed with the preformance there. City Park has lots of Limestone. The rear would slip cranking up Limestone ledges.

    I plan to run the hutchinsons on dirt courses and Panaracers on rocky courses like City park or Kerrville.

    John Banks has a sugar you might find out what he is running.

  4. #4
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    terry, was it the tire stock?

    john is running pythons. john?


    smitty, what do you weigh?

    i used Hutchinson Pythons for quite a while and liked them a lot. the only place they suffered was at high speeds mixed with loose conditions. loose, sand, dirt, rocks, they can be a bit sketchy. on the bonus side they roll fast, are big and float over lots of stuff and you can run them pretty low. available in 2.0 only. 480g

    of the IRC line, the two best all around that i've ridden quite a bit were the IRC Mythos XC and the IRC Notos XC. the Mythos has a front a rear specific tire. the front has offset, mid-height, square knobs that do well is just about any condition. they actually make a sort of griding noise before they let go which can be a really good thing. the rear had a paddle type, mid height, center set of knobs for acceleration and a good transition to the side knobs which are angled a bit for predictable drift in corners. front 515g/rear 540g

    i'm more of a Notos fan though. same pattern front and rear. they roll faster than the Mythos but slower than the Pythons. the knobs are almost a mini-motorcross pattern. offset, with a ramped ceter knob, and really nice outboard, mid-height, "knukles". 1.8, 1.95, 2.10 530g-620g

    another good one would be some of the Continentals. i've used the Leader Pro, Navigator Pro, Cross Country, Double Fighter, and the Traction Pro. all are available in 1.95. the Cross Country is my favorite. paddles with a mid-height knob down the center and cupped out board. most Contis are light as sin! the 1.95 XCs are right at 500g with a kevlar bead.

    oppps, all weights listed are with a kevlar bead.

    Panaracers, as chris mentioned are bitchin! the 1.8 FireXC Pro is FAST! corners well. the catch is that you have to run a bit higher pressure to prevent pinch flats. on the other hand, Panty Racers (this goes for IRC as well) have a foam that runs along side the bead to help prevent pinch flats and flat spotting the rim. the newer Trail Blasters are available in a 1.95. haven't been on those but they pattern seems well thought out. the weight on a set of 1.8 Fire XC Pros is about 500g.

    Tioga makes a really nice all around tire called the Factory XC. from a TPI (threads per inch in the casing) stand point they're at the opposite end. while most companies use a high TPI for a more compliant tire and supple ride, Tioga has what they call FAT 66 casing. instead of the 80-170 TPI found on most they use only 66 TPI. by doing thing, the whole casing helps to prevent pich flats and rim and sidewall damage as opposed to just a narrow strip near the bead. i've run down to 27 PSi on a set 1.95s. with fewer threads, the casing is stiff and holds is shape better with less pressure resulting in more traction AND more rolling resistance (they always "forget" to mentiona that, huh?). i rode a set for a few months off and on. i really likes them for places like Bandera and SA Ranch. they a bit slow on hardpacked trails but i liked the extra confidence in the loose. 1.95s come in at 550g and are a front/rear specific set.

    it may be a bit premature to mention this but i'll throw it out there anyway.

    most companies make two sets of tires. an import with a low thread count (this doesn't include anything in the Tioga line) and a high end with high TPI. spent the extra 8 bucks and get the high TPI with a kevlar bead. kevlar beads are usually easier to get off a rim with out the aid of a tire tool. also, most of the high TPI tires also sport a special durometer (hardness of the rubber) that can GREATLY affect performance. high durometers mean a long lasting tire with less grip in the wet (how often does it rain here?). lower durometer bite better on roots, ledges, off camber sections but wear out faster (how often do you see a rock around here?). most tire durometers range from 40s to 70s.

    pythons - 57
    IRC MOTOS/MYTHOS - 48
    Panaracer - 55
    Continental - 45-60
    Tioga - 55

    bike world usually has some of these in stock but i've found to can save about 20 bucks if you look for them on-line. careful though. i recently was a set IRC NOTOS for 16 dollars. not bad! but i called up, they said i was indeed kevlar but the thread count was down around 40 (too low, personally) and so was the durometer. so i paid an extra 5 and got the high end ones.

    tried to keep it brief but.........



  5. #5
    MoJo Mother Superior Chris aka Killer's Avatar
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    John Banks has pythons on his fisher...

    He doesn't like them, though. He finds they slip out on him. This may be more of a riding style issue though.

    The clearence with his pythons didn't look that great. Personally I think this is a design flaw more than anything else. Quite a shame since otherwise it is one badass bike!

    Anybody know what kinda tires come on the sugar, stock?

  6. #6
    MoJo Bishop Smitty's Avatar
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    I weigh in around 180.

    My Sugar came with a stock set of WTB tires with a ridiculously high tread count. One pass through the smallest amount of mud, and I was suddenly running slicks. Even before the mud they didn't seem to grab hold of very much. I agree that the arch across the back tire is a bit of a design flaw, but it probably seemed like a good idea at the time.

    Carlos - Thanks for your in-depth analysis. I'll take a look at what you listed and see what I can figure out.

    Additional comments are still welcome. Hope to see some people tonight at the time trial.
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  7. #7
    700 Acres Pusher
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    Originally posted by carlos
    john is running pythons. john?

    Yea, John is running these on his Sugar, but was complaining that they were sketchy in the dusty conditions at Mac.



    Originally posted by carlos
    Panaracers, as chris mentioned are bitchin! the 1.8 FireXC Pro is FAST! corners well.

    I believe that the Panaracer FireXC pro tires are the absolute best all round tire here in Texas. I run the 2.1's but with the clearance issue of the sugar I would look at the 1.8's. One of the best things with the Panaracers is that they are the same tire for front and back, but you just reverse them. So as they wear you can rotate them front to back and turn them around. As Carlos says Bammo it is like running brand new tires.

    And they come in pretty colours like red, blue and yellow. That is the real reason that I like them. I get them to match my bike.
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  8. #8
    MoJo Bishop Smitty's Avatar
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    Thanks guys for the information. I'm going to give the Panaracer 1.8's a shot as soon as I can get them (hopefully today). I will be sure to let you know what I find out about how they work on my Sugar. Thanks again.
    Some are wise. Some are otherwise.

  9. #9
    MoJo Priest almeraz's Avatar
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    PANARECERXC FIRE

    IS THE WAY TO YOU WILL LIKE IT
    Jorge Chavez Almeraz

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    hey jorge, we still have that bar. want it?

  11. #11
    MoJo Priest almeraz's Avatar
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    SURE!!!!!!!

    YEA CARLOS , WHEN IS YOU NEXT WORKING DAY?
    Jorge Chavez Almeraz

  12. #12
    Mojo Shaman John's Avatar
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    Re: John Banks has pythons on his fisher...

    Originally posted by Chris aka Killer
    He doesn't like them, though. He finds they slip out on him. This may be more of a riding style issue though.

    The clearence with his pythons didn't look that great. Personally I think this is a design flaw more than anything else. Quite a shame since otherwise it is one badass bike!

    Anybody know what kinda tires come on the sugar, stock?
    An update for those who have expressed interest. The tires originally coming with the Sugar 1 are tubeless, Bontrager, I think. Since I did not want to be distubed, I had Tommy build some tubed wheels. He suggested and I installed Hutchison Pythons. I was not originally happy, because the tire seemed to slip out on the turns, especially in the current dusty conditions of McAllister. Upon suggestions, I lowered the air pressure. I was running 40 lbs and over the past week have been riding at 37-38 lbs. The tires corner much better. I have spoken to some guys my size or bigger that are riding at 30-35 lbs without pinch flats. I am still experimenting. I liked the lower profile of the Pythons thinking that they would easily switch from trails to paved roads for those occasional road rides.

    I still feel that the Panaracers have been the best tire that I have tried, but I have not had them on the Sugar and don't know what the clearance would be.
    Raise your skill level to the level of the trail, donít bring the level of the trail down to your riding level.

    Don't mind me, I'm just along for the ride.

  13. #13
    try explaining the internet to a bum!
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    swaping a worn rear to the front and the new front to the rear can be dangerous. i tried that a few times and then rode Twilight Zone....moment of silence.....it was very scary. and not the good scary like when you go down Gary's Downhill but the kinda scary like when you're "dropping the kids off at the pool" and you feel a kidney drop out the back door!

    best thing to do is to take the old worn out tire and throw it away OR tie it to the bumper of someones car with a 10 ft line AND THEN take the one up front and put it in the rear and replace it with a new one. get it?

    anyway, john is right, Pythons have a very large casing so running them below 40 psi si not that crazy. i run mine at 30. they don't do too well one the loose but the lower pressure does help quite a bit.


  14. #14
    MoJo Bishop Smitty's Avatar
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    I got a set of the 1.80 Panaracers, and they seem to work awesome. Haven't ran them on the full range of trails yet, but so far so good. And the clearance on my Sugar is great. I'll keep everyone informed of what I think as I go.
    Some are wise. Some are otherwise.

  15. #15
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    yeah, let us know what you think and what conditions they work best in.

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